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	<title>Comments on: Remembering Lies: Interview with Psychiatric Abuse Victim Jeanette Bartha</title>
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	<link>http://www.process.org/discept/2009/11/15/remembering-lies-interview-with-psychiatric-abuse-victim-jeannette-bartha/</link>
	<description>conversation and contention, for your attention</description>
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		<title>By: jeanettebartha</title>
		<link>http://www.process.org/discept/2009/11/15/remembering-lies-interview-with-psychiatric-abuse-victim-jeannette-bartha/comment-page-1/#comment-691</link>
		<dc:creator>jeanettebartha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Jan 2010 19:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.process.org/discept/?p=621#comment-691</guid>
		<description>Poor Unfortunate Soul November 17, 2009 9:59 am

Reply to the above:

I am glad you find strength from my expressions of experiences with junk-science based psychotherapy.

I want to make it clear that multiple personalities and all the &quot;therapy&quot; that goes along with it is crap. When I fled from therapy, all the nonsense ceased. That is to say, there never were other personalities, except in the mind of my incompetent psychiatrist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Poor Unfortunate Soul November 17, 2009 9:59 am</p>
<p>Reply to the above:</p>
<p>I am glad you find strength from my expressions of experiences with junk-science based psychotherapy.</p>
<p>I want to make it clear that multiple personalities and all the &#8220;therapy&#8221; that goes along with it is crap. When I fled from therapy, all the nonsense ceased. That is to say, there never were other personalities, except in the mind of my incompetent psychiatrist.</p>
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		<title>By: robertwalthall</title>
		<link>http://www.process.org/discept/2009/11/15/remembering-lies-interview-with-psychiatric-abuse-victim-jeannette-bartha/comment-page-1/#comment-688</link>
		<dc:creator>robertwalthall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Dec 2009 05:39:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.process.org/discept/?p=621#comment-688</guid>
		<description>I had sort of a breakthrough myself tonight...I listened to a G-Spot podcast about 42p.org and the whole experiment, for those of you who dont know, was sort of a try at making something viral, like a bogey man, as the creator called it.

But in it, was the idea of looking outside of the box, so to say, at yourself, as a change in perception. I have had the view that &#039;the process&#039; not as the church of final judgement, was a set of ideas and practices, that allowed one to break the consensus &#039;status quo&#039; of the time, or making yourself &#039;clear&#039; as a scientologist would say....

But I then look at this Blog, and realized tonight, almost all of the postings to some degree make you see that picture without realizing it, at least in my mind; there should be no dogma with freeing a mind of its compulsive behaviors.

The Process Blog is a &#039;process&#039; in itself, in my opinion, and I can see how as an art collective, it can be a powerful tool to shake minds! But underneath it all, its up to the courage of the viewer to see past themselves, and look at themselves in a way they have not before.

In this respect, I am glad that there is no cult, people would say, controlling a set of beliefs, to help people free themselves, as the best person that can do that is themselves...

I was the person that created a forum some of you may have seen, labeled &#039;Thee Process Underground&quot; It seems kind of immature to me that ive made that in the past, even though some good conversations were brought to mind there. Now I see why those topics seeded themselves, and it just now sprouted in my mind.

The Process is what you make it. I am glad that it is still here. I am glad that I have caught this virus. I hope that people &#039;Spread the Disease&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had sort of a breakthrough myself tonight&#8230;I listened to a G-Spot podcast about 42p.org and the whole experiment, for those of you who dont know, was sort of a try at making something viral, like a bogey man, as the creator called it.</p>
<p>But in it, was the idea of looking outside of the box, so to say, at yourself, as a change in perception. I have had the view that &#8216;the process&#8217; not as the church of final judgement, was a set of ideas and practices, that allowed one to break the consensus &#8217;status quo&#8217; of the time, or making yourself &#8216;clear&#8217; as a scientologist would say&#8230;.</p>
<p>But I then look at this Blog, and realized tonight, almost all of the postings to some degree make you see that picture without realizing it, at least in my mind; there should be no dogma with freeing a mind of its compulsive behaviors.</p>
<p>The Process Blog is a &#8216;process&#8217; in itself, in my opinion, and I can see how as an art collective, it can be a powerful tool to shake minds! But underneath it all, its up to the courage of the viewer to see past themselves, and look at themselves in a way they have not before.</p>
<p>In this respect, I am glad that there is no cult, people would say, controlling a set of beliefs, to help people free themselves, as the best person that can do that is themselves&#8230;</p>
<p>I was the person that created a forum some of you may have seen, labeled &#8216;Thee Process Underground&#8221; It seems kind of immature to me that ive made that in the past, even though some good conversations were brought to mind there. Now I see why those topics seeded themselves, and it just now sprouted in my mind.</p>
<p>The Process is what you make it. I am glad that it is still here. I am glad that I have caught this virus. I hope that people &#8216;Spread the Disease&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: Poor Unfortunate Soul</title>
		<link>http://www.process.org/discept/2009/11/15/remembering-lies-interview-with-psychiatric-abuse-victim-jeannette-bartha/comment-page-1/#comment-687</link>
		<dc:creator>Poor Unfortunate Soul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 17:59:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.process.org/discept/?p=621#comment-687</guid>
		<description>In my college days, instead of experimenting with drugs or alcohol, I chose sleep deprivation, self-hypnosis (meditation), and the occult.

One of the side-effects was the personification of my conscience as a separate entity.  He didn&#039;t always tell me to do the right thing.  He was more focused no making sure I understood all the various angles of whatever decision I was contemplating.  He was like the Windows &quot;Are you sure?&quot; button for my life.

I called him Isaac.

Isaac and I would talk about philosophy and human nature.  It was nice to be able to converse with yourself out loud.  You didn&#039;t need other people around for interesting chats.

I &quot;found&quot; through past life regression that I had been present at the destruction of Atlantis.  Indeed, I was partially responsible.  The Golden Pyramid of Ar with its 3-story tall Van de Graaff generator was pushed too far, too well and detonated the entire continent in a burst of white light.

It was me (as Kasmine Argos), Mordlock, and Rochelle who had been overseeing the experiment and caused the destruction.

Kasmine did not manifest herself independently.  Not yet.

I rekindled an old flame and found a girl friend who suffered undiagnosed DID.  She knew only about one of the personalities.  She was naive and proper.

Her first personality was male and was extremely protective of her.  He did not like me.  He did not like being with &quot;another man&quot; either.

To make her / him happy, I pulled Kasmine out of my brain and let her have a go.  She called herself Jennifer to modernize her name.  Her personality was very similar to my girlfriends main personality.

Now I had two people to talk to when I was alone.

My girlfriend had a strange, wild side.  Involved in &quot;cutting&quot; and drinking blood.  Drinking, smoking.

When confronted, another personality made itself known.  This was another female personality.  The main personality did not know about this one and the male personality promised dire consequences if I told her.

I referred to this new female as the demon succubus slut because she talked about Satanic rituals even going so far as to tell me what having sex with the Devil was like.

To deal with this personality, I decided I needed another one of my own to face her.

I found Jacob.  He was ostensibly a sociopath, being a past life of mine, and a Nazi doctor.  In reality, he desperately suppressed his emotions because of what happened to his mentally retarded brother during WWII.

Jacob was easily a counter to this demonic female personality and they would drink each others&#039; blood and perform other strange sexual rites.

Oddly, I never had sex with my girlfriend under any personality.  The demonic one had a laugh... it was cold and seductive.  Knowing.  I did not want her.

She joined the Navy and we broke up.

I was now left with Isaac, the mediator; Jennifer, the innocent; and Jacob, the sociopath.

We talked about many things.  So many things that my brain decided we needed more participants.

Jacob&#039;s brother, Joseph was borne.  He was a simple man with simple ideas.

So far, all of these personalities had been my decision.  My choice.  I enjoyed subdividing my own personality into distinct bits.  It was a way to explore what made me, me without seeing a psychologist / psychiatrist which I could not afford.

I&#039;d grown up suffering from depression.  I was suicidal at 5 years old according to my mom and trouble controlling my anger.

Seeing myself from the outside made it easy to discover why I had these problems and gave me insight on how to fix them.

Then, the first uninvited personality came.

She called herself Isabel and was full of rage.  She wanted equal time.  She stormed the building where Isaac lived and demanded she be given voice.  The inhuman monsters she brought with her made argument a bad idea.

We accepted her as another part of who I was.  An uncontrolled, turbulent piece of my mind.

It was the night I was working alone and late, closing at the restaurant where I was employed.

Another voice came whispering in.  He just slithered along side the rest of us and introduced himself.  Belial, the Devil he called himself.

This was far from the medieval juggler Malachi I had been nurturing.

Belial was all that was evil and I did not want to give it a voice.

In trying to get rid of them, in trying to convince them to re-integrate themselves into my base personality, I realized I had somewhat of a dependency on them.

I called it an addiction to myself.  As much as I feared them now, I still needed them.  I wasn&#039;t sure I could handle all of these different aspects as actual pieces of who I am.

Jacob was the first to volunteer.  He knew by being re-integrated first, he would be given the most influence over my personality.

Once Jacob went, the others slowly allowed themselves to fade, as well.

I miss them all dearly.  I occasionally write fiction and normally try to channel one or more of them into my stories.

As much as I miss them, I fear them far more.

I will never allow myself to experiment on my own consciousness like that again.

Self-directed psychological warfare is generally a bad idea.

I&#039;ve been on medication for my depression and anxiety for about 11 years now.  That has obviated the need that made me create them in the first place.

The human mind is an amazingly complicated and delicate thing.  It is difficult for someone who hasn&#039;t experienced a loss of control over one&#039;s own thoughts to even imagine it is possible.

Yet, every time we watch a television commercial or listen to a political speech we are being programmed.

It is the nature of the mind.  It cannot be helped.

To understand that the mind must take in all input does not mean you have no control over how it is processed.

Jeanette was able to keep that .1% of doubt alive.  That saved her sanity.

Her strength is an inspiration.  Her ability to question her situation and analyze it effectively while still living inside of it is nearly miraculous.

I understand there are a number of people who believe they have DID simply because they have been diagnosed as such.

Are your therapists working to help you integrate those alternates back into your core?  Or are they simply working to discover &quot;who else&quot; is in there?

Which is better for your mental health in the long run?  Do you want to be divided or unified?

I love you and pray for you all.  Being one is far more manageable than being many.  It makes life so much easier.

Please be well and make wise decisions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my college days, instead of experimenting with drugs or alcohol, I chose sleep deprivation, self-hypnosis (meditation), and the occult.</p>
<p>One of the side-effects was the personification of my conscience as a separate entity.  He didn&#8217;t always tell me to do the right thing.  He was more focused no making sure I understood all the various angles of whatever decision I was contemplating.  He was like the Windows &#8220;Are you sure?&#8221; button for my life.</p>
<p>I called him Isaac.</p>
<p>Isaac and I would talk about philosophy and human nature.  It was nice to be able to converse with yourself out loud.  You didn&#8217;t need other people around for interesting chats.</p>
<p>I &#8220;found&#8221; through past life regression that I had been present at the destruction of Atlantis.  Indeed, I was partially responsible.  The Golden Pyramid of Ar with its 3-story tall Van de Graaff generator was pushed too far, too well and detonated the entire continent in a burst of white light.</p>
<p>It was me (as Kasmine Argos), Mordlock, and Rochelle who had been overseeing the experiment and caused the destruction.</p>
<p>Kasmine did not manifest herself independently.  Not yet.</p>
<p>I rekindled an old flame and found a girl friend who suffered undiagnosed DID.  She knew only about one of the personalities.  She was naive and proper.</p>
<p>Her first personality was male and was extremely protective of her.  He did not like me.  He did not like being with &#8220;another man&#8221; either.</p>
<p>To make her / him happy, I pulled Kasmine out of my brain and let her have a go.  She called herself Jennifer to modernize her name.  Her personality was very similar to my girlfriends main personality.</p>
<p>Now I had two people to talk to when I was alone.</p>
<p>My girlfriend had a strange, wild side.  Involved in &#8220;cutting&#8221; and drinking blood.  Drinking, smoking.</p>
<p>When confronted, another personality made itself known.  This was another female personality.  The main personality did not know about this one and the male personality promised dire consequences if I told her.</p>
<p>I referred to this new female as the demon succubus slut because she talked about Satanic rituals even going so far as to tell me what having sex with the Devil was like.</p>
<p>To deal with this personality, I decided I needed another one of my own to face her.</p>
<p>I found Jacob.  He was ostensibly a sociopath, being a past life of mine, and a Nazi doctor.  In reality, he desperately suppressed his emotions because of what happened to his mentally retarded brother during WWII.</p>
<p>Jacob was easily a counter to this demonic female personality and they would drink each others&#8217; blood and perform other strange sexual rites.</p>
<p>Oddly, I never had sex with my girlfriend under any personality.  The demonic one had a laugh&#8230; it was cold and seductive.  Knowing.  I did not want her.</p>
<p>She joined the Navy and we broke up.</p>
<p>I was now left with Isaac, the mediator; Jennifer, the innocent; and Jacob, the sociopath.</p>
<p>We talked about many things.  So many things that my brain decided we needed more participants.</p>
<p>Jacob&#8217;s brother, Joseph was borne.  He was a simple man with simple ideas.</p>
<p>So far, all of these personalities had been my decision.  My choice.  I enjoyed subdividing my own personality into distinct bits.  It was a way to explore what made me, me without seeing a psychologist / psychiatrist which I could not afford.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d grown up suffering from depression.  I was suicidal at 5 years old according to my mom and trouble controlling my anger.</p>
<p>Seeing myself from the outside made it easy to discover why I had these problems and gave me insight on how to fix them.</p>
<p>Then, the first uninvited personality came.</p>
<p>She called herself Isabel and was full of rage.  She wanted equal time.  She stormed the building where Isaac lived and demanded she be given voice.  The inhuman monsters she brought with her made argument a bad idea.</p>
<p>We accepted her as another part of who I was.  An uncontrolled, turbulent piece of my mind.</p>
<p>It was the night I was working alone and late, closing at the restaurant where I was employed.</p>
<p>Another voice came whispering in.  He just slithered along side the rest of us and introduced himself.  Belial, the Devil he called himself.</p>
<p>This was far from the medieval juggler Malachi I had been nurturing.</p>
<p>Belial was all that was evil and I did not want to give it a voice.</p>
<p>In trying to get rid of them, in trying to convince them to re-integrate themselves into my base personality, I realized I had somewhat of a dependency on them.</p>
<p>I called it an addiction to myself.  As much as I feared them now, I still needed them.  I wasn&#8217;t sure I could handle all of these different aspects as actual pieces of who I am.</p>
<p>Jacob was the first to volunteer.  He knew by being re-integrated first, he would be given the most influence over my personality.</p>
<p>Once Jacob went, the others slowly allowed themselves to fade, as well.</p>
<p>I miss them all dearly.  I occasionally write fiction and normally try to channel one or more of them into my stories.</p>
<p>As much as I miss them, I fear them far more.</p>
<p>I will never allow myself to experiment on my own consciousness like that again.</p>
<p>Self-directed psychological warfare is generally a bad idea.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve been on medication for my depression and anxiety for about 11 years now.  That has obviated the need that made me create them in the first place.</p>
<p>The human mind is an amazingly complicated and delicate thing.  It is difficult for someone who hasn&#8217;t experienced a loss of control over one&#8217;s own thoughts to even imagine it is possible.</p>
<p>Yet, every time we watch a television commercial or listen to a political speech we are being programmed.</p>
<p>It is the nature of the mind.  It cannot be helped.</p>
<p>To understand that the mind must take in all input does not mean you have no control over how it is processed.</p>
<p>Jeanette was able to keep that .1% of doubt alive.  That saved her sanity.</p>
<p>Her strength is an inspiration.  Her ability to question her situation and analyze it effectively while still living inside of it is nearly miraculous.</p>
<p>I understand there are a number of people who believe they have DID simply because they have been diagnosed as such.</p>
<p>Are your therapists working to help you integrate those alternates back into your core?  Or are they simply working to discover &#8220;who else&#8221; is in there?</p>
<p>Which is better for your mental health in the long run?  Do you want to be divided or unified?</p>
<p>I love you and pray for you all.  Being one is far more manageable than being many.  It makes life so much easier.</p>
<p>Please be well and make wise decisions.</p>
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